purchasing puppies
I thought I would take the time to share my past experience and provide information that would help folks make an educated decision if they decide to purchase a pup. While there is much available on the internet to do ones research about a breed prior to purchasing many add a pup to their home and do the research after the fact. I hope you find this information useful.
PET SHOP PUP There are several sources of puppy availability. First we can talk about the pet shop pup. These puppies come from high production breeders. The producers of these dogs have little knowledge about dog breeds themselves. They do now genetic testing, have no concern as to how well the dogs meet the standard of the breed. They dont care about size, structure or health of their breeding stock. Temperament is never considered as these are caged dogs so it doesnt matter to them. Often times these dogs only see humans at feeding time. The resulting pups lack any real life exposure. They are shipped en masse to stores to be sold. Many die during this process as it is a great stress to their very under developed immune system. They are then placed in a cage with other puppies from different places. Their only handling is the cleaning of their cage, feeding and whatever treatment they may need. They are handled by whoever may be interested in purchasing them. They are often difficult to house train as they have had to live in the environment where they eliminate. These pups are sold to whoever is willing to pay the price. The pet shop staff possesses little to no knowledge of the breed. The family dynamics is never a consideration.
INTERNET SALES These pups differ in that usually the seller is not as quite a high of producer. There are some very slick web sites out there that will show you lovely pictures of their dogs. If you study them you will see that often all pictures are done outside. This is because the life the dog leads is not one of an indoor companion but a kennel/outside dog that has the purpose to produce. These dogs most often have no health testings and are bred randomly just to produce pups. When they no longer are money makers they too are sold or disposed of. Once again the handling these dogs receive is minimal. The breed knowedge is minimal. The person will tell you their dogs are healthy so there is no reason to test. Yep, they are healthy enough to breed and sell puppies. Beyond that once you leave you are on your own. You will find no support from this breeder should you have a problem.
CASUAL BREEDERS This would refer to a person that has a few intact corgis and chooses to have a litter periodically. This can be a person that truly loves their dogs but just hasnt taken the time to truly learn about the breed, the genetic issues in the breed or what the standard is. They have good intentions but lack the knowledge to be supportive to people that choose to purchase their pups. Pups may be raised inside or outside but often get a bit more attention then the aforementioned dogs. Usually you find these folks by ads in the local paper.
SHOW BREEDERS This is a breeder that is quite involved in the fancy. These folks usually are active in their breed club, actively show dogs, do genetic health testing and are concerned about the temperament of their dogs. These people will selectively breed their dogs based on their physical appearance and genetic background. They hope to continue or better the dogs they currently have. They screen their potential buyers and have guidelines that must be met before selling a pup. Often times they have a waiting list for their pups. These folks will provide a guarantee regarding the health and temperament of the dog and will agree to take the dog back at any time should you not be able to keep it. Pups are often sold on a spay/neuter contract.
Now I will say that not all folks that show dogs are reputable. Some breeders. This is where one needs to spend the time and ask questions. Go to the Pembroke Welsh Corgi Club of America and digest the information they have to offer. Go to the regional club in your areas website and learn even more. Visit dog shows in your area and learn to develop an eye for what you like. Find out who the breeder is.
RESCUE While most rescues rarely have puppies they do often have young adult dogs. These dogs come from all backgrounds. Good rescue organizations have had these dogs in a foster situation to evaluate them. They have been made current on their vaccinations, spayed/neutered, heartworm tested. Rescues typically place their dogs using an application process to help place just the right dogs in the right homes. They are there for counsil and support if it is necessary. They too are usually placed on contracts and may be returned to rescue at any time should you not be able to keep the dog.
This is just the tip of the iceberg but should give you an overview of what you may find when you search. Regardless of where they come from they CAN and DO often make good companions. One just has a much better support system and a pup with a better start from one that is involved in the fancy.
PET SHOP PUP There are several sources of puppy availability. First we can talk about the pet shop pup. These puppies come from high production breeders. The producers of these dogs have little knowledge about dog breeds themselves. They do now genetic testing, have no concern as to how well the dogs meet the standard of the breed. They dont care about size, structure or health of their breeding stock. Temperament is never considered as these are caged dogs so it doesnt matter to them. Often times these dogs only see humans at feeding time. The resulting pups lack any real life exposure. They are shipped en masse to stores to be sold. Many die during this process as it is a great stress to their very under developed immune system. They are then placed in a cage with other puppies from different places. Their only handling is the cleaning of their cage, feeding and whatever treatment they may need. They are handled by whoever may be interested in purchasing them. They are often difficult to house train as they have had to live in the environment where they eliminate. These pups are sold to whoever is willing to pay the price. The pet shop staff possesses little to no knowledge of the breed. The family dynamics is never a consideration.
INTERNET SALES These pups differ in that usually the seller is not as quite a high of producer. There are some very slick web sites out there that will show you lovely pictures of their dogs. If you study them you will see that often all pictures are done outside. This is because the life the dog leads is not one of an indoor companion but a kennel/outside dog that has the purpose to produce. These dogs most often have no health testings and are bred randomly just to produce pups. When they no longer are money makers they too are sold or disposed of. Once again the handling these dogs receive is minimal. The breed knowedge is minimal. The person will tell you their dogs are healthy so there is no reason to test. Yep, they are healthy enough to breed and sell puppies. Beyond that once you leave you are on your own. You will find no support from this breeder should you have a problem.
CASUAL BREEDERS This would refer to a person that has a few intact corgis and chooses to have a litter periodically. This can be a person that truly loves their dogs but just hasnt taken the time to truly learn about the breed, the genetic issues in the breed or what the standard is. They have good intentions but lack the knowledge to be supportive to people that choose to purchase their pups. Pups may be raised inside or outside but often get a bit more attention then the aforementioned dogs. Usually you find these folks by ads in the local paper.
SHOW BREEDERS This is a breeder that is quite involved in the fancy. These folks usually are active in their breed club, actively show dogs, do genetic health testing and are concerned about the temperament of their dogs. These people will selectively breed their dogs based on their physical appearance and genetic background. They hope to continue or better the dogs they currently have. They screen their potential buyers and have guidelines that must be met before selling a pup. Often times they have a waiting list for their pups. These folks will provide a guarantee regarding the health and temperament of the dog and will agree to take the dog back at any time should you not be able to keep it. Pups are often sold on a spay/neuter contract.
Now I will say that not all folks that show dogs are reputable. Some breeders. This is where one needs to spend the time and ask questions. Go to the Pembroke Welsh Corgi Club of America and digest the information they have to offer. Go to the regional club in your areas website and learn even more. Visit dog shows in your area and learn to develop an eye for what you like. Find out who the breeder is.
RESCUE While most rescues rarely have puppies they do often have young adult dogs. These dogs come from all backgrounds. Good rescue organizations have had these dogs in a foster situation to evaluate them. They have been made current on their vaccinations, spayed/neutered, heartworm tested. Rescues typically place their dogs using an application process to help place just the right dogs in the right homes. They are there for counsil and support if it is necessary. They too are usually placed on contracts and may be returned to rescue at any time should you not be able to keep the dog.
This is just the tip of the iceberg but should give you an overview of what you may find when you search. Regardless of where they come from they CAN and DO often make good companions. One just has a much better support system and a pup with a better start from one that is involved in the fancy.
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Carmen on
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Amen to this! Thank you for your wonderful post. I wish that everyone would take as much time to realize where some puppies really begin. I researched for six months before deciding on a breeder.
I do warn people against buying from a petshop or a online breeder. If you want to know why, go on google and type in corgi puppymill and click on the Wisconsin puppymill link. It breaks my heart every time.
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Permalink Reply by Cindi on
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Thanks, Sam. Wonderful post. And even though brief, very comprehensive and informative. As you know, I work for a pet supply store. Thankfully, PetSmart is all about rescue and shelters. PetSmart donates millions of dollars toward them each year.
I get questions asked every day about where to get dogs. Here we have a number of back yard puppy mill breeders. They're everywhere. What they can't sell they place with pet shops. I've had 2 Yorkies just in the last few weeks that died after being purchased at a pet shop for premium prices ($800/dog). It just makes one heartsick!
Folks get tired of me telling them to do their homework and find a reputable breeder. My suggestions are:
1. Be sure you have access to the mom and dad dog.
2. Be sure they are raised under foot and not in cages.
3. Be sure they have only one or two breeding pairs and only breed one or two litters a year.
4. Be patient. If it means being on a waiting list for a healthy pup, do it.
5. Any breeder worth their salt will offer a health guarantee and stand by it.
6. IF IT COMES FROM SOUTH ALABAMA IT'S A PUPPY MILL DOG!
Number 6 usually ticks folks off, but it's very true. I wish I could have pictures of all of the puppy mill dogs that come through our store! Danes. Schnauzers. Yorkies. Malteses. Poodles. Small dogs, especially! Shepherds. Labs. Aussies. Shelties. And especially CORGIS! Oh dear God the list goes on and on!!!
Of our dogs, all came from backyard breeders or large volume breeders. We may have gotten them through rescues, but all but Rudy comes from a mill. All have had behavior or health problems. We're it up to me, we'd have STRICT laws and enforce them.
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Permalink Reply by Sam on
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A misconception here that I thought I would let you know. Most of the reputable breeders I deal with usually only own the bitch. Much thought is spent searching for just the right stud dog with a pedigree that will compliment her. With todays ability to ship semen and the technology to predict ovulation often times studs are chosen from a great distance. A reputable breeder will have the bitch available to meet, have pictures of the dad (though sometimes he is available) a pedigre of both, health testings of both and will offer a health guarantee far beyond the 72 hours pet shops do.
People that have breeding pairs rarely have quality in mind. A breeding pair tells one that they are merely to produce pups. Reputable breeders have a goal in mind of producing quality. If one mating doesnt produce what they hope the will begin the search again for another stud that may compliment the attributes of the bitch. Obviously having "breeding pairs" would not constitute looking for improvement.
There are some key areas where the mills exist in large numbers. Kansas, Oklahoma, Missouri seem to be the biggies.
I would say the largest amount of our rescue dogs were purchased at a pet shop. Many have proven to be great dogs. Our mission is to educate, place dogs appropriately and make sure our potential adopters are able to provide for the needs of the dog. We offer support regarding proper feeding, exercise requirements, training and ideas to help elicit appropriate behaviors. We do not place dogs just because someone wants one. Corgis can be challenging in some homes and require a structured environment. Most behaviors can be redirected if caught early .
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I would like to agree that you should make sure to look at the bitch at least. I visited a breeder back in 2001 after Courtney died. I was very excited to see the corgis. I knew I wanted to see the bitch. They trotted out the bitch and told me they thought she may be pregnant, but they couldn't tell. I was appalled, because the poor dog's tummy was nearly to the ground. She sure looked pregnant to me, but I'm guessing she always looked like that because she was overbred. I also met the stud. Both dogs were poor representations of the breed.
I never returned to the facility and I have now figured out that it is more than likely a puppy mill type facilty. You learn these lessons the hard way.
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That's the kind of thing that gets under my skin. I ask customers to do their research and then go to the AKC site to find breeders. Sadly, the puppy mill dogs around her come with AKC registry, which is sad. Anyone have experience with the AKC and their registry? Have they lowered their standards? Any suggestions??
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What people also dont undertand is that AKC is merely a registry. It in no way signifies the "quality" of dogs being bred. While looking for a pup knowing they are AKC registered is a good place to start it is only a small portion of the things one should look for when seeking out a dog. If you search you will find there are many new small and unknown registries out there. These have been designed by high production breeders to be able to offer a "registered" dog. They also do not have the requirements or the cost that AKC does. Many just look for the word registered and have no concerns beyond that. http://www.showdog-magazine.com/Articles/registries.htm Here is one link I found that offers info on some of them.
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Permalink Reply by Charlie on
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Like Sam said, AKC doesn't have any way to control to breeding to standard. They simply register dogs (and bring in lots of revenue for it). The casual, backyard, and puppy mill breeders can bred AKC pups. When they do not sell the puppies with a "limited registration" and a spay/neuter contract, then the new pup's owner can choose to breed with any another AKC pup, and those pups can also be registered. That is where "quality" slides and conformation to standard can get dramatically lost.
As for the small and unknown registries, Sam is spot-on again. I was reading an article about the Amish puppy mills in Pennsylvania. Many of them use these other registries, because of the low $10 registration fee (and probably cannot get AKC reg). This article also indicated that the Amish advertise heavily on the internet, and the ads read like a casual breeder's ad. These puppy mill internet ads make you think that there is only one breeding pair, raised as beloved house pets, and the puppies have been handled and nurtured. The reality is that hundreds of dogs are housed in cramped cages in a large barn out back (typical puppy mill). If you go to look at the pups, the scene is staged so that the pups are brought out to you. You don't go inside, and you are never allowed to see "what's in the barn". Shame.
I would recommend never "mail ordering" a dog from the internet (or other advertising). Even if you have to drive several hundred miles to the breeder's location, it should be worth the peace of mind to see how the animals are being raised. If the breeder doesn't invite you inside, or you have any other feeling that "something's fishy", drive home empty handed. (Charlie is from a casual breeder. I spent about an hour in their house looking at the puppies, asking questions, and seeing the adult dogs run comfortably about. It was clear that the dogs were well behaved, well-balanced housepets.)
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Permalink Reply by Chris West on
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This was a point of contention for my husband and I. When originally looking for a pup to fit what I wanted, the closest breeder I could find was in Arkansas (we live in Iowa). My husband wanted to just have the pup shipped to us. I flat out refused. I said I would never buy a pup without inspecting its living area and the condition of the other dogs on the property. It doesn't matter how pretty the pictures, nothing will show what it is really like unless you actually go there. I was going to have to drive 10 hours both ways, and was totally willing to do that to make sure I was getting the healthiest pup possible.
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A better place to try to find a good breeder is at the breeds official club, such as the Pembroke Welsh Corgi Club of America. This isn't 100% perfect way to avoid a bad breeder, but breeders do have to pass some quality control before becoming a member.
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Being quite involved in rescue I am also pretty aware of the "high production" breeders in our state. I am contacted often for references to purchase a corgi pup. I do work hard to educate those that are wishing to learn. Sadly many purchase what is quickly available. Charlie adds some good insight regarding some things to look for. Rarely are internet sales a good idea. One that touts frequent availability should also pose a red flag for you. One of the high production kennels in our state has numerous litters planned and is rarely without pups to sell. The facility leaves lots to be desired but people buy anyway.
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The scariest site I ever encountered was here in Iowa and offered at least 12 different breeds and at the time I looked at their website, they were advertising 20!!!!! different litters available at the same time!!!! That is crazy!!! I contacted them to look into it further, and was told it was a big family operation and that all the different families specialized in one breed and then they just all sold them on the same site. I don't care what you say, that was the fishiest thing I had every heard, and I make sure to warn anyone I run into against buying puppies from these people. If it looks like there puppies are mass produced on their website, then they probably are.
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