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Permalink Reply by Anna Morelli on May 28, 2011 at 5:52pm

Don't make changes yet, stay with what the puppy is used to,  his system is easily upset at this age and he already has many changes to cope with.  Pups at this age do best with three meals a day and, unless you can provide that, free feeding may be a good option, just take up the food around 8PM until morning.  He does not need water at night either.  You can gradually make changes as the pup gets a bit older, around 12 wks.Keep in mind that his requirements will keep changing with his size and age.  If you got the pup from a good breeder, your breeder should be your best source of advice.

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Permalink Reply by Jane Christensen on May 28, 2011 at 7:24pm

Taste of the Wild is an all stages food and I feed all my dogs/pups this. I  feed my adults a handful ( about a 1/2 cup) 3 times a day and I think I fed my pups a bit more than that! I agree that if you can do free feeding this would be good. Do nake sure if you continue that you feed the lower protien TOTW. As Ann said any change needs to be gradual. Also at about 12 + weeks if  the pup stops eating....it's not the food but the teething and the food needs to be softened.

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Permalink Reply by Daniel on May 28, 2011 at 7:32pm

I understand the concern for a gradual change but I do not want to feed kibble, I am going to be feeding the two products I mentioned above at least at first. They are both 5 star foods, I'm slightly concerned about mixing because some stores say you shouldn't mix and others say its no big deal. I may wait to do the switch until he is settled into our home as to not have so much change at once. Thank you for taking the time to respond!

 

also I hear many people say you shouldn't feed to high of a protein diet, I'm wondering what exactly should I feed in its place?, as dogs dont need grains, and a minimal amount of fruits and vegetables. wouldn't it be wiser to just feed a good food and just not over feed with it? This is an honest question, if not protein then what?.

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Permalink Reply by Beth on May 28, 2011 at 11:10pm

Too much protein is definitely not good for growing puppies.   High protein can cause overly-rapid growth, which can lead to bone and joint problems.

Remember that free-ranging animals experience life outside in harsh weather conditions, with way way WAY more exercise than a human family will generally provide (unless you are on a working farm, hunt extensively, etc), and have very high parasite loads.   Their nutritional needs are therefore different from a house pet who does not burn calories keeping warm nor feeding worms and ticks.

They also eat parts of the animal that are not very digestible (skin, hair).  

Canids are considered carnivorous omnivores.  Close relatives such as coyotes do, indeed, eat lots of non-meat items.  Finally, the direct ancestors of dogs were more likely scavengers than hunters (or else they would not have followed around humans looking for their garbage) and dogs have been selectively bred for many generations to thrive on diets consisting of human cast-offs. 

 

So, I guess the point is to feed what you like but do be aware that I've heard of several instances of high-protein diets causing problems in growing puppies.  Dogs are omnivorous and can digest many things, including fruits and veggies and yes grains.  Given free choice, mine will readily eat all veggies and fruits we have ever offered, and also eat wild plant material that they find growing outside.  Were they "free-ranging" scavengers, they would do the same, as most likely did their ancestors.  

 

My obligate carnivore cat, on the other hand, is not impressed by proffered pieces of vegetables.   Fruit makes her curl her nose and walk away.  Orange peel can actually be used as a deterrent to keep cats out of garden beds.  My dogs eat orange peel given half a chance.

 

In other words, take what you read on internet food sites with a very large grain of salt.  :-) 

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Permalink Reply by Beth on May 28, 2011 at 11:12pm

Oh, and if feeding kibble in the 400 cal/cup range, a good baseline for growing pups is 1.5 cups a day divided into three feedings.  Add or reduce according to pup's condition.  

 

I can't give advice on amounts for freeze-dried or frozen meat products, as I've not fed them.

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Permalink Reply by Jane Christensen on May 28, 2011 at 11:34pm

TOTW ranges  from 24% to 32% protein, you would want the lower protein ones which is probably what the pup is on. I believe that would be the salmon and one other but not sure which.

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Permalink Reply by Beth on May 28, 2011 at 11:41pm

Yep, TOTW has a very wide range of proteins, depending on the formula.

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Permalink Reply by Melissa and Franklin! on May 29, 2011 at 2:53am

The Sierra Mountain is the lowest protein formula as far as I know. It has something like 24% protein. It is grain free and the main protein source is lamb. Its probably safe to stick with whatever TOTW formula your breeder was feeding. At least for now. I'm not familiar with the freeze dried food, but the medallions from Nature's Variety have a feeding guide, and there should be one on the website as well. If you are set on feeding raw, I would start with a TINY bit at a time, like 1/4 or less of a medallion added to each meal so as not to have too much protein.

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Permalink Reply by Beth on May 28, 2011 at 11:40pm

Oh, and puppies (like human babies) should have DHA in their diet for optimal brain development. 

 

Neither chicken nor beef are great sources, which is why better commercial puppy foods add fish oil.  So if you are not feeding puppy food, you might want to look into supplementing with some fish (canned salmon and sardines and mackerel are all good, though they tend to be salty) or fish oil.

 

With puppies, you also need to be very careful about calcium levels, so make sure what you are feeding is approved for All Life Stages, not just adults. 

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Permalink Reply by Daniel on May 29, 2011 at 2:52pm

thank you Beth and everyone, we have him home now and will keep him on the kibble for now. I did some calculations for his weight and I came up with just shy of a cup and a half a day split three ways so I guess I was on the right track! Right now I am just leaving food available until he adjusts to his new home, he doesn't seem to eat much so I'm not worried about over feeding. Soon I will get him on a schedule and slowly start introducing the raw and perhaps some fresh mashed vegetables or other yummy things to keep the protein from becoming too much. He is so cute, I will post some more pictures soon. Again thanks for all your helpful responses!

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